46 Comments

  1. On Facebook, a local columnist posted a picture of Ryan and Biden. My comment was that Biden is an asshole and needs retiring. Now the liberals are taking offense to me calling him an asshole. Would the statement have been truer had I said Biden is a boorish hack who lacks manners? I think “asshole” was succinct.

  2. Sharon says:
    October 11, 2012 at 23:42

    On Facebook, a local columnist posted a picture of Ryan and Biden. My comment was that Biden is an asshole and needs retiring. Now the liberals are taking offense to me calling him an asshole. Would the statement have been truer had I said Biden is a boorish hack who lacks manners? I think “asshole” was succinct.

    I did the same on FB, succinct

  3. I’m certain that if you had said that Paul Ryan was the [insert slang term for the sphincter here] who needed to be retired, our friends on the left wouldn’t have objected at all.

    I didn’t watch it, but a CNN poll had 48% saying that Mr Ryan won and 44% saying that Mr Biden won, while a CBS poll had Mr Biden the winner 50% to 31% who thought Mr Ryan had won.

  4. .This was a good debate. The moderator did an excellent job, gaining the respect of the participants, both of whom responded to the topic at hand in a mostly civil manner.

    Both Joe Biden and Paul Ryan responded in a way which will please their supporters. However the Dems had more to gain by a good performance than the Repubs, due to the impact of the first debate.

    On the economy, it was a draw as each, using the same set of facts, gave their own version of same. The disagreement on the mathematics of the Ryan Plan were not reconciled. The 47% issue was a serious Romney error which Ryan was not able to overcome. Ryan, when challenged, was unable to indicate how he would have handled the recovery. Biden made points on the auto industry bail out, exposing once again Romney’s advise at the time to let them go bankrupt. In OH, this is a major plus for the Dems. Ryan, when challenged, was unable to give the detailed tax deductions and exemptions in the Romney/Ryan tax overhaul.

    On foreign policy, Biden was able to demonstrate his detailed historical knowledge plus the info he gets from being directly involved real time, thus he came to this topic as a heavy favorite, and it showed. Ryan attempted but failed to make points on the Bengazi problem.

    I’m on the road, so more later. The bottom line is that each satisified their own base. The impact on the independents – my guess is that Biden’s performance may have recovered some independents for the Dems, those who may have fallen away based on the first debate.

  5. Wagonwheel says:
    October 12, 2012 at 10:12

    .This was a good debate. The moderator did an excellent job, gaining the respect of the participants, both of whom responded to the topic at hand in a mostly civil manner.

    Where was that debate??? The one I saw had Biden’s Civil Disruptions as overtalking, laughing, and being rude to Paul Ryan 82 Times. A similar instance was Algore’s sigh in his debate. And the moderator was a partisan.

    The unasked but needed question from Ryan was to ask Biden what was so funny for the first hour. But that’s OK, Biden looked like an ASS.

  6. Now the liberals are taking offense to me calling him an asshole.

    Left wingers are great at taking offense. Everything offends them, especially religious symbols on public property. But they are even better at giving offense. Just look at Perry. He whines about “Incivility” then calls us racists, unpatriotic, and terrorists all the time.

  7. .This was a good debate. The moderator did an excellent job, gaining the respect of the participants, both of whom responded to the topic at hand in a mostly civil manner.

    The moderator did a horrible job. She completely lost control of the debate as she allowed Biden to get away with interrupting constantly. Each side was supposed to have a full two minutes to make their points, but there were times when Ryan had maybe ten seconds before Biden started talking over him. If the contest was about who could be the biggest boor, then Biden won hands down. If it was about who could look composed and presidential while sticking to the facts, then Ryan won easily.

  8. And on matters of substance, Biden’s talk about Iran’s nuclear program was not reasurring. He claims we have “Tough” sanctions on Iran, and that the world is on our side. Problem is – the Iranians don’t care. They’re proceding with their nuclear weapons program anyway. What does Biden propose to do about that?

  9. The 47% issue was a serious Romney error which Ryan was not able to overcome.

    Are you kidding? Ryan slam dunked it, comparing it to all the gaffes Biden makes. The whole plce was laughing.

  10. I’m on the road, so more later.

    Oh!! We’ll wait with baited breath!!

    Biden’s foreign policy “expertise.” Puh-lease. Did everyone catch his lies about his Afghanistan and Iraq War votes?? He’s an expert a’right — at lying.

  11. Well, Joe Biden certainly made a jackass out of himself last night, which is pretty much standard procedure for Joe. He does it so often it’s become his trademark, but he usually does it with a big smile on his face and with a disarming display of personal warmth.

    What was different last night was Biden’s obnoxiously rude and mean-spirited condescension, his repeated interruptions, his boorish attempts to throw his weight around.

    Biden made a fool of himself on national TV and proved to voters he’s unfit to hold the office of Vice President, much less the Presidency itself. Joe Biden disqualified himself as a viable candidate in the upcoming election.

  12. Romney and Ryan need to provide all the details of their plans. They need to list the minutia of their Big-Government micro-managed approach to repair the problems my people intentionally created. Or, I’ll spend the rest of my life claiming they don’t have a plan at all.

    *cough*
    *hack*
    *wheeze*
    *gag*
    *choke*
    *ralph*
    *buick*
    <—————— cleans his mouth out with lots of water, finishing it off with mint flavored Scope.

    So, how'd I do channeling the Socialist liar Perry? Please tell me I hit the crooked nail on it's bent head because I don't want to torture myself like that again. I swear I heard 10 brain cells committing suicide over it.

  13. I will agree that the optics of the debate were not too impressive, by either participant laughing, smirking, interrupting, but the substance was important, especially for Dems who were disappointed in the President in the previous debate, and hopefully for independents and undecideds.

    “President Obama must seal the deal with voters that he deserves another term. His running mate, given his time in the spotlight, put the President’s case in good light – even if he grinned too much in the process.”

  14. Biden’s performance was geared to the ordinary American squeezed by the recession and perhaps soon by the tax collector, should the Romney/Ryan tax plan ultimately prevail.

    On taxes, Biden emphasized that without the details of the R/R plan revealed, it is difficult to determine the impact on the American middle, but it is apparent that the wealthy will get a reduction, again, as under Bush-43, the failed trickle down approach revitalized. Moreover, Ryan failed to step up with the details, so we are left with using assumptions which strongly suggest that the arithmetic does not support the R/R claims about their plan.

    On Medicare, Biden emphasized the hit future seniors would take on the voucher approach, to which Ryan had no response other than that current Medicare is not sustainable, which is true if nothing is done. There is plenty that can be done, in my view, such as making benefits means tested, and further cost cutting of medical costs by improvements in efficiency of service provision and eliminating unnecessary tests and procedures. Medical service providers have to step up to meet these challenges.

    On the security lapses in Libya, the full story is not yet in. I find the Ryan attacks to be largely unsubstantiated. And btw, the point was made that Ryan himself voted to reduce the allocation for security, so his party bears some responsibility here. Ryan and the Repubs have tried to make a political issue here, unconvincing to me, at least.

    On Iran, Ryan tried to make points on the alleged weakness of our policy, contradicting the actual effectiveness of the economic sanctions, supported by almost all nations, causing economic chaos in Iran. Biden repeated that there will be no nuclear bomb permitted for Iran. The claim that the President did not meet with Netanyahu a week or so ago was countered by pointing out that their are frequent and close contacts with the Prime Minister of Israel.

    On substance, I think that Biden was much more effective than Ryan, although I do credit Ryan for standing his ground, and for making an effective closing statement for his side.

  15. Re Ryan, look at this:

    On Ryan and his anti-stimulus posture, which came up in the debate, consider this:

    Many of these correspondences were in line with what virtually every lawmaker does in carrying out his or her constituent duties. But as Biden charged in Thursday night’s debate, for Ryan — who has taken a hard line against both the stimulus and government spending in general — the requests have opened him up to charges of hypocrisy and insincerity.

    “I love that,” Biden said. “This was such a bad program, and he writes me a letter saying, writes the Department of Energy a letter saying, `The reason we need this stimulus, it will create growth and jobs.’ His words. And now he’s sitting here looking at me.”

    Now I don’t fault Representative Ryan for looking after his constituents, but I do fault him for dissing the very stimulus which he politically criticizes in his campaign for the R/R ticket, a program in which he has himself taken advantage. This bugs the hell out of me!

    [WW asked me to move this comment from the inappropriate thread, but he copied it over himself. I have made one forrmating change, but no changes were made to the comment. -- Editor]

  16. Of course Mr Ryan tried to get as much out of the stimulus plan as he could for his constituents, once it was passed; to not have done so would have been irresponsible. But he voted against passing the stupid thing in the first place.

  17. WW wrote:

    On Iran, Ryan tried to make points on the alleged weakness of our policy, contradicting the actual effectiveness of the economic sanctions, supported by almost all nations, causing economic chaos in Iran. Biden repeated that there will be no nuclear bomb permitted for Iran. The claim that the President did not meet with Netanyahu a week or so ago was countered by pointing out that their are frequent and close contacts with the Prime Minister of Israel.

    One wonders why, if the Vice President had been correct about “the actual effectiveness of the economic sanctions,” the European Union is approving further economic sanctions against Iran. What would be the point, if the current sanctions were working?

  18. Joe Biden lacks the poise, the balanced temperament, and the emotional maturity necessary for electoral politics on the national stage. He’s always been a grinning, gaff-prone, grandiose boor who talks too much, talks over people, and postures like a high school drama queen, but his shockingly inappropriate performance on national TV demonstrated that he’s completely incapable of disagreeing without being disagreeable.

    Does anyone want Joe Biden to answer the 3am crisis phone call? Can Biden be trusted to keep his head in a national emergency?

    I’d rather Big Bird take the call.

  19. Rope:
    Does anyone want Joe Biden to answer the 3am crisis phone call? Can Biden be trusted to keep his head in a national emergency?

    And we saw how well bimBO handled the Libya call too.

  20. Republicans and Paul Ryan have no regard for the truth, so must be reminded constantly:

    Biden: And, by the way, they talk about this Great Recession if it fell out of the sky, like, “Oh, my goodness, where did it come from?” It came from this man voting to put two wars on a credit card, to at the same time put a prescription drug benefit on the credit card, a trillion-dollar tax cut for the very wealthy. I was there. I voted against them. I said, no, we can’t afford that.
    And now, all of a sudden, these guys are so seized with the concern about the debt that they created.

  21. Wagonwheel says:
    October 13, 2012 at 14:51

    Republicans and Paul Ryan have no regard for the truth, so must be reminded constantly:

    Yes the current Occupier of 1600 PA Ave. NW, Wash., DC 20001 has to be reminded that hourly and his little sidekick the Grinning, Laughing VP are walking talking blunder and truth bending machines. Libya was because of the video!!! And now we find out there was real time video of the raid. If bimBO says he didn’t know, then the incompetent bimBO can’t pick competent staff.

  22. Medical service providers have to step up to meet these challenges.

    IOW, the government is going to tell doctors and nurses how to do their jobs.

  23. I am amused that Wagonwheel quoted this:

    Republicans and Paul Ryan have no regard for the truth, so must be reminded constantly:

    Biden: And, by the way, they talk about this Great Recession if it fell out of the sky, like, “Oh, my goodness, where did it come from?” It came from this man voting to put two wars on a credit card, to at the same time put a prescription drug benefit on the credit card, a trillion-dollar tax cut for the very wealthy. I was there. I voted against them. I said, no, we can’t afford that.
    And now, all of a sudden, these guys are so seized with the concern about the debt that they created.

    As your Senator, Joe Biden voted to authorize President Bush to use force in both Iraq and Afghanistan. In simple words: he lied.

    Of course, Senator Biden did vote against the Medicare Part D program . . . because he supported an even more generous giveaway. But I’d point out here that we on THE FIRST STREET JOURNAL have said all along that Medicare Part D was a completely wrong thing to pass; it did add hundreds of billions to the deficit.

  24. I will agree that the optics of the debate were not too impressive, by either participant laughing, smirking, interrupting, but the substance was important

    Quit playing moral equivalence. The only person who was laughing, smirking, and interrupting was your guy, Biden.

  25. Of course, as Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton, who ran the famous 3:00 AM phone call ad, also got that call, and she did just as well with it as did President Obama. :(

  26. On Iran, Ryan tried to make points on the alleged weakness of our policy, contradicting the actual effectiveness of the economic sanctions, supported by almost all nations, causing economic chaos in Iran.

    The problem is – none of it is deterring Iran in the least. They are still developing nuclear weapons. They don’t care about Obama or “The rest of the world”, and they’re certainly not the least bit afraid or him.

  27. York, the attack on our Benghazi consulate was triggered by a video, but it was a video of Barack Obama, Joe Biden, and John Kerry at the Democrat Convention spiking the ball and celebrating the death of Osama bin Ladin.

    The sight of Democrats dancing on bin Ladin’s grave with chants of GM is alive and bin Ladin is dead! infuriated the Muslim terrorists. It was the Democrat’s insensitivity to Islamic feelings, the waving of bin Ladin’s bloody shirt in a crass political attempt to generate votes, that motivated Al Queada to retaliate against the symbol of Barack Obama’s Administration in Libya.

    Our Ambassador and the three Americans who died with him were murdered because Barack Obama and Joe Biden couldn’t stop bragging on world wide TV about killing Islam’s greatest contemporary hero.

  28. I agree, Republicans voted in lock-step against everything, even if they liked it, then happily partook of that which they liked. That’s who they are, virtually refusing to govern, which is what they were elected to do. They should be fired forthwith. The pro-business party turned out to be totally unproductive, compared to the pro-business Dems, who focused on helping our economy to recover.

  29. The only recovery Democrats are interested in is recovering the illegal campaign contributions they made to Obama’s election effort. That’s why so many so-called green energy loans go sour.

    Setting up corrupt green energy corporations designed to fail in the market place, but somehow succeed in lining the pockets of Obama’s campaign bundlers with taxpayer money is what passes for an economic recovery in ObamaWorld.

  30. Here’s an excerpt from Tony Lee writing at Breitbart 10/13/12.

    Danish Wind Turbine Company that Received over $50 Million in Stimulus Lays Off 800 Workers

    A Danish wind turbine company whose subsidiaries received over $50 million in U.S. stimulus dollars announced on Friday it has cut more than 800 jobs in the United States and Canada this year and may be forced to lay off another 800 employees in North America.

    This is yet another green energy company that received wasteful stimulus funds and does not even have anything to show for it.

    According to Reuters, Vestas, the wind turbine maker, saw its order intake go down by 24 percent during the first half of the year…

  31. WW wrote:

    I agree, Republicans voted in lock-step against everything, even if they liked it, then happily partook of that which they liked. That’s who they are, virtually refusing to govern, which is what they were elected to do. They should be fired forthwith. The pro-business party turned out to be totally unproductive, compared to the pro-business Dems, who focused on helping our economy to recover.

    The assumption behind your statement is that one must vote in support of everything the President wants, or you are refusing to govern; I don’t accept that at all. You can govern by not changing things, you can govern by leaving things alone, and you can govern by stopping bad legislation from being passed. The Republicans’ biggest failure is that they couldn’t stop enough of President Obama’s agenda.

  32. Danish Wind Turbine Company that Received over $50 Million in Stimulus Lays Off 800 Workers

    A Danish wind turbine company whose subsidiaries received over $50 million in U.S. stimulus dollars announced on Friday it has cut more than 800 jobs in the United States and Canada this year and may be forced to lay off another 800 employees in North America.

    This is yet another green energy company that received wasteful stimulus funds and does not even have anything to show for it.

    According to Reuters, Vestas, the wind turbine maker, saw its order intake go down by 24 percent during the first half of the year…

    I hasten to point out again, ropelight, that the sudden increase in the supply of natural gas from the fracking process, which has produced a large drop in prices, have suddenly become unpredictable, formidable, and significant competition to green energy projects, which I’m sure you know. But that won’t stop you from making your usual partisan/political point; I know that quite well.

    Are you aware that the government also subsidizes oil companies: oil, propane gas, natural gas, coal, and nuclear?

    For the sake of attacking the global warming problem due to fossil fuel combustion, does it then make sense for the government subsidize the fledgling renewable energy start-up companies? I think so!

  33. Wagonwheel says:
    October 13, 2012 at 20:52

    Danish Wind Turbine Company that Received over $50 Million in Stimulus Lays Off 800 Workers

    A Danish wind turbine company whose subsidiaries received over $50 million in U.S. stimulus dollars announced on Friday it has cut more than 800 jobs in the United States and Canada this year and may be forced to lay off another 800 employees in North America.

    This is yet another green energy company that received wasteful stimulus funds and does not even have anything to show for it.

    According to Reuters, Vestas, the wind turbine maker, saw its order intake go down by 24 percent during the first half of the year…

    I hasten to point out again, ropelight, that the sudden increase in the supply of natural gas from the fracking process, which has produced a large drop in prices, have suddenly become unpredictable, formidable, and significant competition to green energy projects, which I’m sure you know. But that won’t stop you from making your usual partisan/political point; I know that quite well.

    Well, you just made the case for the OPEN FREE MARKET to do its work. You know, the one the Libs hate and want to control.

  34. Mr Wheel wrote:

    I hasten to point out again, ropelight, that the sudden increase in the supply of natural gas from the fracking process, which has produced a large drop in prices, have suddenly become unpredictable, formidable, and significant competition to green energy projects, which I’m sure you know. But that won’t stop you from making your usual partisan/political point; I know that quite well.

    It seems as though a lot of President Obama’s economic policies are stricken with “unpredictable, formidable, and significant competition” and other problems. For being the people who are supposed to run our government and manage our problems, they certainly seem to have a remarkable lack of foresight, don’t they?

    Now, had they not spent this money on these projects, solar and wind energy projects meeting “unpredictable, formidable, and significant competition” would be on their own, having lost no one’s money but their investors.’

    Are you aware that the government also subsidizes oil companies: oil, propane gas, natural gas, coal, and nuclear?

    And we here at THE FIRST STREET JOURNAL oppose those subsidies as well. Why should the government subsidize profitable — or unprofitable — industries or businesses or corporations? When your Editor says that we should cut spending to the bone, these types of things, which should never have been started in the first place, should be among the first things to go.

    For the sake of attacking the global warming problem due to fossil fuel combustion, does it then make sense for the government subsidize the fledgling renewable energy start-up companies? I think so!

    Even if we accept your premise for the sake of argument, the Obama Administration has shown a rather remarkable lack of prescience in picking the right “fledgling renewable energy start-up companies.” Yet, just a few miles from my house, Green Energy Capital Partners LLC partnered with the Kovatch family and built the Pennsylvania Solar Park, to generate 10.6 megawatts of electricity. They are taking advantage of both state and federal tax breaks — things which should not exist — but have managed to build the place without grants and loans from the Obumble Administration. If the company can’t generate enough sparktricity to pay for their investments, well, that’s on them, not the taxpayers. Your Editor provided some, but not all, of the concrete used in that project.

    Of course, I accepted your premise solely for the sake of discussion; in the real world, I don’t support it at all.

  35. I hasten to point out again, ropelight, that the sudden increase in the supply of natural gas from the fracking process, which has produced a large drop in prices, have suddenly become unpredictable, formidable, and significant competition to green energy projects, which I’m sure you know. But that won’t stop you from making your usual partisan/political point; I know that quite well.

    But we are constantly told that Obama and his minions are the Smartest People on the Face of the Earth, in which case they should have seen this coming. It’s like their stimulus, which was supposed to keep unemployment under 8%. But then, I have generally considered obama’s “Intelligence” to be vastly over-rated. He is more clever than intelligent.

  36. For the sake of attacking the global warming problem due to fossil fuel combustion, does it then make sense for the government subsidize the fledgling renewable energy start-up companies? I think so!

    Global Warming is a myth. It’s just the latest Fashionable Worry. Back in the 70′s the “Experts” said we were all going to die from overpopulation. In the 80′s, the “Experts” said we were all going to die of AIDS. Now the “Experts” are saying we’re all going to die of Global Warming. Yawn.

  37. Why do people believe in Global Warming? Well, most left wingers are secularists, meaning they reject traditional religion. But Man instinctively needs something to believe in, so the left wingers have created new religions. The latest is Global Warming. Like all religions, it has sin (pollution), a Supreme Being (Gaia), and of course an Apocalypse. The Global Warming kooks think Mother Nature will spread her wrath, the oceans will rise and we’re all going to die. Of course, I believe in a real God, and I don’t think that God is going to punish us for driving a Suburban instead of a Prius. And He gave us all this coal, oil, and natural gas so it would make our lives easier.

  38. One of the things that demands an explanation is how come it always turns out that Obama’s contributors and big-time bundlers are behind these so-called green energy projects and when they fall flat the investors who gave most generously to finance Obama’s campaigns are the ones who get their money back while it’s always the taxpayers who’re left holding the bag?

    Ya think it might be man-made gas has anything to do with it?

  39. Drudge has a post about Global Warming ending 16 years ago and he’s got a nifty chart to make the point. The usual alarmists deny the evidence.

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