25 Comments

  1. Representative democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It may exist only until voters discover they can vote themselves largess from the public treasury.

    From that moment on, the selfish majority supports candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that the republic collapses over a loose fiscal policy, always to be quickly followed by a brutal dictatorship. (Author Uncertain)

    Our dictator is already in the White House.

  2. I’m glad we learned that lesson from Jefferson and do not do that, except in the fantasy minds of certain ideologues who assume things about which they know almost nothing.

    Moreover, a dysfunctional Republican Congress has succeeded in stopping democracy dead in its tracks, which is the largest single source of our lack of sufficient progress on our economy.

    These same Republicans were largely responsible for creating our great recession, and now are responsible for filibustering remediation efforts. And they now think the American voters will turn power over to them, which has got them in a panic, driving them to suppress the vote.

    Jefferson surely would not approve!

  3. Wagonwheel says:
    January 5, 2012 at 14:58 (Edit)

    I’m glad we learned that lesson from Jefferson and do not do that, except in the fantasy minds of certain ideologues who assume things about which they know almost nothing.

    Moreover, a dysfunctional Republican Congress has succeeded in stopping democracy dead in its tracks, which is the largest single source of our lack of sufficient progress on our economy.

    These same Republicans were largely responsible for creating our great recession, and now are responsible for filibustering remediation efforts. And they now think the American voters will turn power over to them, which has got them in a panic, driving them to suppress the vote.

    Jefferson surely would not approve!

    WW, maybe should look at this list. It’s all the Bills stuck in Congress. The only problem is the House passed all these bills and sent them to the Senate where they just sit. The DO NOTHING group is the Democrat Controlled SENATE. So produce some info before you read the DNC daily propaganda and parrot it out.

    http://murphy.house.gov/index.cfm?sectionid=168&sectiontree=29,168&itemid=1880

  4. Yorkshire, first of all, I am not like you. I do not read DNC propaganda and parrot it back. So you are projecting. What I write are my own views based on extensive reading on a daily basis.

    Secondly, the do-nothing group are the Senate Republicans, whose record breaking use of the filibuster has provided them with near total control of the Senate by the minority party. Moreover, your party refuses to compromise and is more than willing to hold our nation hostage, like with the debt ceiling crisis which resulted in a lowering of our credit rating. This is not governing, Yorkshire, it is interference with the business of governing, especially pitiful when our nation is in crisis. This is inexcusable!

  5. Wagonwheel says:
    January 5, 2012 at 16:11 (Edit)

    Yorkshire, first of all, I am not like you. I do not read DNC propaganda and parrot it back. So you are projecting. What I write are my own views based on extensive reading on a daily basis.

    Then don’t do the same to me as you constantly project my answers are influenced by Rush. So stop projecting on me.

    Secondly, the do-nothing group are the Senate Republicans, whose record breaking use of the filibuster has provided them with near total control of the Senate by the minority party.

    Get a list of the filibusters to make your point.

  6. Thomas Jefferson said:

    “The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.”

    To which Wagonwheel responded:

    I’m glad we learned that lesson from Jefferson and do not do that, except in the fantasy minds of certain ideologues who assume things about which they know almost nothing.

    Uhhh, just what do you think our welfare system is? And you, of course, thoroughly support taking money from those who earn it to give to those who do not, in that you want to tax the top producers more, to give to the less productive.

    Moreover, a dysfunctional Republican Congress has succeeded in stopping democracy dead in its tracks, which is the largest single source of our lack of sufficient progress on our economy.

    Really? It wasn’t the Republicans who wouldn’t pass a budget or appropriations bills; the House did their work. It was in the Senate that everything died, the Senate controlled by the Democrats, which wouldn’t even bring up the House bill for consideration.

    However, it looks like you are going to see that progress has been made in the economy: now that the ridiculous and ineffective stimulus program has been over and done with, and Republicans have prevented more meddling in the economy by President Obama and the Democrats, we are finally seeing an improvement in the employment picture.

    Your editor — and others — have told you before: the best thing that government can do for the economy is to stop trying to fix it, and let the economy adjust on its own. Now, thanks to what you call “a dysfunctional Republican Congress” preventing further government meddling, what you were told would happen is starting to happen.

    Or, more succinctly, we were right, and you were wrong.

  7. Perry, contrary to your efforts to conflate the House and the Senate, we don’t have a “dysfunctional Republican Congress.” The senior half of our bicameral legislature is controlled by Democrats and has been since George Bush was President, which of course includes the first two years of Obama’s when the House was also under Democrat Party domination.

    Obviously the recently elected GOP House majority most closely represents the will of the American people. That’s what elections are for. Clearly, it’s the ossified Democrat controlled Senate which is out of step with modern American values.

    Not one of Obama’s policies have resulted in an improvement in our economic system. Everything he advocates has proved to be detrimental to our nation. He’s the problem and anyone who supports his failures is contributing to our ongoing suffering.

  8. WW writes

    Secondly, the do-nothing group are the Senate Republicans, whose record breaking use of the filibuster has provided them with near total control of the Senate by the minority party.

    How many times have we heard this, too? Perhaps the reason for this record is the record number of times the Democrat-controlled Senate refused debate and/or amendments by the GOP minority.

  9. WW writes

    And they now think the American voters will turn power over to them, which has got them in a panic, driving them to suppress the vote.

    Pure fantasy. More to reality is Obama and the Dems are in a panic for botching their turn in power, and so they’re actively getting groups like ACORN ready to to steal votes, and have the ridiculous Justice Dept. sue everybody who attempts to require common sense security measures like showing an ID to vote.

  10. “Uhhh, just what do you think our welfare system is? And you, of course, thoroughly support taking money from those who earn it to give to those who do not, in that you want to tax the top producers more, to give to the less productive.”

    Welfare, Mr Editor, is an attempt to provide the basics of subsistence to those who, mostly through no fault of their own, have been left out of the economy, either by racism, or by mental and physical disabilities, or by a lack of sufficient education. It is the least that we as a society can do for our less fortunate bretheren, and is an outcome of a Christian sensibility/value which comes from none other than Jesus Christ’s example:

    “The biographies of Jesus depict him repeatedly reaching out to those at the bottom of the social pyramid–poor people, women, Samaritans, lepers, children, prostitutes and tax collectors. Jesus was also eager to accept people who were well-placed, but he made clear that all, regardless of social position, needed to repent. For this reason, he invited the rich young man to sell all of his possessions and give the proceeds to the poor. (Matthew 19:16-30, Luke 18:18-30, Mark 10:17-31)”

    And how is it, Mr Editor, that you do not speak out against corporate welfare, in the same breath? It is alleged that we spend almost double the amount per year on corporate welfare than on family welfare. We’re talking roughly $100 billion vs $50 billion.

    Now shall I bring up how much we have spent on our recent two wars? Why are you not objecting strongly to that destructive outlay and waste of resources, Mr Editor. Your priorities are pretty badly skewed!

    To make your point, you ideologues zero in on one point, while ignoring the big picture, a big picture which demonstrates how far off our priorities have wandered. And I have not even mentioned the obscene distribution of wealth which the American version of capitalism has produced. We can do much better, but our right wing ideologues have a strangle hold on the productive use of our resources, then complain about stealing from them to assist our poor. Where are your ethical standards, Mr. Editor?

  11. “However, it looks like you are going to see that progress has been made in the economy: now that the ridiculous and ineffective stimulus program has been over and done with, and Republicans have prevented more meddling in the economy by President Obama and the Democrats, we are finally seeing an improvement in the employment picture.”

    Ha! That’s quite a joke there, Mr Editor. Your meme is obvious: Blame President Obama for all that’s wrong, and take credit for the beginnings of improvements. Sorry, but today is a continuum of the policies of the Obama administration, with a bit of a start from the outgoing Bush administration with the TARP. You simply cannot honestly get away with your double-speak, Mr Editor, without a stern counter to your fantastic folly!

  12. “Obviously the recently elected GOP House majority most closely represents the will of the American people.”

    Sure thing, ropelight, like the favorability rating or our dysfunctional Congress is about 10%, correct? This makes your statement questionable, to be charitable in my choice of words.

  13. WW:
    Sure thing, ropelight, like the favorability rating or our dysfunctional Congress is about 10%, correct? This makes your statement questionable, to be charitable in my choice of words.

    So, on the recent battle of the payroll cut, who was the disfunctional part of Congress. The House passed a year extension which is what BO wanted. Then the Senate changed it to 2 months which BO said he wanted. Then the Senate left town with a dysfunctional bill sent back to the House with agree or else. Seems to me, the Dems caused all the problems.

  14. Yea right, Yorkshire, the House Bill was loaded with poison pills, or did you not notice that?

    It is not too late to extend these tax cuts for the full year, but this would be against the Republican desire to stifle economic recovery in order to defeat President Obama.

    Your party as presently configured and behaving is truly despicable, determined only to protect the upper 1% or so, to hell with the rest of us, you included Yorkshire!

    [Video added by the Editor]

  15. Perry, I don’t expect you to be charitable with your words, but I would appreciate some forthrightness instead of your usual tap dance and double talk.

    I took you to task for conflating the House and the Senate when you attempted to smear the GOP controlled House for the sins of the Democrat controlled Senate: you referred to “the dysfunctional Congress” without making the necessary distinction between the two chambers of our bicameral legislature.

    Yet in your stupid knee-jerk response you committed exactly the same dumb-ass misrepresentation using almost the very same words. Since voters rewarded the GOP with a majority in the House in the most recent election, it stands to reason that if “Congress” gets low favorability scores it’s the Democrats in the Senate who are largely the ones held in contempt.

    You can “question” my statement, but you can’t question the facts without making a fool of yourself.

  16. WW shows utter confusion:

    It is not too late to extend these tax cuts for the full year, but this would be against the Republican desire to stifle economic recovery in order to defeat President Obama.

    If it was “against the Republican desire to stifle economic recovery in order to defeat President Obama,” then why in the world did the GOP House wish to pass a full year extension in the first place??

    Yea right, Yorkshire, the House Bill was loaded with poison pills, or did you not notice that?

    Except that, of course, both parties have always attached something or other to bills. Perhaps WW can cite precisely what was “poison” (aside from the full year extension of the payroll tax cut which Obama said he wanted, then didn’t, and which WW now says isn’t too late to pass … even though the House wanted to do just that already … you can see how disjointed WW’s thinking, such that it is, goes) in the House bill.

  17. Pingback: Unemployment down to 8.5% « THE FIRST STREET JOURNAL.

  18. Wagonwheel says:
    January 5, 2012 at 23:59

    Yea right, Yorkshire, the House Bill was loaded with poison pills, or did you not notice that?

    It is not too late to extend these tax cuts for the full year, but this would be against the Republican desire to stifle economic recovery in order to defeat President Obama.

    Your party as presently configured and behaving is truly despicable, determined only to protect the upper 1% or so, to hell with the rest of us, you included Yorkshire!

    Looks to me like a personal attack. What a riot WW. If Bush was still president and a Dim House did the same thing you would be singing their praises from one end of the country to the other. You really do have a problem with your double standards. But if I were in charge of the House now and BO asks for the other 10 months, I’d tell him NO. The House gave to him once, and that ship sailed.

  19. ropelight wrote:

    I took you to task for conflating the House and the Senate when you attempted to smear the GOP controlled House for the sins of the Democrat controlled Senate: you referred to “the dysfunctional Congress” without making the necessary distinction between the two chambers of our bicameral legislature.

    The answer is simple: for our Democrat from Delaware, unless the Congress fails to enact President Obama’s proposed legislation, in exactly the form the President wants it, that Congress is dysfunctional. Odd though it may seem, Mr Wheel seems to view our Congress the way Hugo Chavez sees his, a rubber-stamp for the President’s wishes.

    The problem with his view is that we actually had a rubber-stamp Congress, the 111th, completely controlled by the Democrats, and the voters — yes, in our system, the people actually do get a voice, and a choice — looked at the “accomplishments of President Obama and the eleventy-first Congress, heard their message that they needed even more Democrats to further impose the President’s agenda, and chose instead to kick the Democrats out of power in the House and drastically reduced their majority in the Senate. The public saw what President Obama and the Democrats were doing, and they didn’t like it.

    WW likes to call the Republicans dysfunctional, but, in fact they are quite functional: they are doing just what they told the voters they would do. Had the voters not liked that promise, they could have voted for the Democrats.

  20. WW wrote:

    It is not too late to extend these tax cuts for the full year, but this would be against the Republican desire to stifle economic recovery in order to defeat President Obama.

    [Guffaws!] It was the Republicans who were insisting on a full year extension!

    Of course, we have noted that the economic recovery seems to be picking up steam just as the GOP has prevented further attempts by the Democrats to “fix” the economy. The Republicans were right all along, and y’all were wrong.

  21. WW wrote:
    It is not too late to extend these tax cuts for the full year, but this would be against the Republican desire to stifle economic recovery in order to defeat President Obama.

    You know the Founding Dads in the Constitution made THREE Separate Branches of the Government for a reason. They did not want all the power vested in one, and none in the other two. If one Branch can’t convince or work with the other branch, then the Constitution is working.

  22. How easy it is for our wingnut friends on here to forget all about the poison pills which the House Repubs put into their payroll tax cut extension bill:

    “Despite loud warnings from Senate Democrats and a veto threat from President Obama because of poison pills within the text, House Republicans Tuesday passed legislation to renew a 2 percent payroll tax holiday and extended unemployment benefits of one more year.

    The bill passed 234 – 193, with 10 Democrats joining with the Republicans and 14 Republicans pitching in with the Dems.

    In a private conversation Monday, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid again warned House Speaker John Boehner that his bill remains dead on arrival in the Senate. In particular, Democrats and the White House oppose a number of GOP-backed provisions: a measure forcing the Obama administration to expedite its decision about whether to green light construction the Keystone XL pipeline; out-year spending caps that could further reduce funding to key federal programs; and other restrictions including one that would allow states to drug test unemployment applicants.

    The GOP bill also includes a steep increase in Medicare costs for middle class and upper class beneficiaries to help offset the cost of the payroll holiday. Per the Associated Press, it would “rais[e] premiums for ‘high-income’ Medicare beneficiaries, now defined as those making $85,000 and above for individuals, or $170,000 for families.””

  23. Wagonwheel says:
    January 6, 2012 at 22:43

    How easy it is for our wingnut friends on here to forget all about the poison pills which the House Repubs put into their payroll tax cut extension bill:

    It’s funny to sit here and read your faux indignation of what the Republicans did, especially when they learned them from the Dems. Sorry, not convincing. And Hairy Reed doesn’t run the House, nor does Boehner run the Senate. And there is nothing in the Constitution that says that. But the Constitution requires the House to put together the spending bills.

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